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PostPosted: 26 Nov 2016, 23:17 
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Joined: 12 Dec 2014, 14:32
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Location: Eastern Mass
Many don't know it, but the modern in-line black powdah rifles aren't anything new. They first appeared with flip-open breeches, similar to a Trapdoor Springfield, in the late 1700s. The 52-caliber Hall rifle pictured below was 1st patented in 1811 and was only delayed in adoption by the US military by the war of 1812.

It finally was officially adopted as the 1st breech-loading rifle ever issued to US troops in 1819, with the first models issued as flintlock ignition. It is a marvel of engineering! And truth be told, while Eli Whitney and the cotton gin get the public credit for interchangeable parts, it was the Hall rifle, and associated tooling as designed by the inventor John Hall, that should be properly credited with a production style for consistent tooling and gauging, so that parts were truly interchangeable. In fact, they took 100 different Hall rifles off the production line at Harpers Ferry and the Simeon North production facility ... took them apart ... and reassembled them with all different parts used in the assembly and EVERY rifle met the acceptance specs and criteria.

I've been wanting an original flintlock version for a LONG time, but I refuse to mortgage the house to do so. I saw this later percussion version on auction with low bids and I threw in a low bid and surprise - surprise - I won it! The shape it arrived in was much better than the auction pictures and description. To add more value, this model is only one of 4,000 produced, which makes it the most rare in regards to production model numbers. I could easily flip it and make a good $500 or twice that!

It is a breech loading 52-caliber rifle. As seen in the pictures, you flip open the lever in front of the trigger guard and the breech block opens. You put in the powder (82-grn and 100-grn service loads) then add a 0.525" (52-cal) roundball on top, close the action, put on a cap .. bring to full cock and fire away.

Some interesting features are:

* All interchangeable parts
* 1st issued breech loaded to a standing army
* Truly ambidextrous rifle, both lefties and righties can operate it. (Hammer is amidst the action, so the sights are actually off-set to the left by a good 1/4", not unlike the Bren machine gun of WW2).
* Has a screw adjustable sear to adjust the let-off from a hair trigger to a battle trigger
* Had a rate of fire twice that of muzzleloaders at that time (early 1800s)
* Accuracy was greater than muskets of that time, hitting 2X that of other arms on man-sized targets at 100-yards

The first 4 photos below are of the 1843 model I just stole ... and HECK YES I will shoot it! Yeah, it has some gas escape where the breech closes, not unlike a revolver ... but it is a hoot to shoot! ... and I resolve to have one someday in flintlock, then I will complete my collection of shootable black powdah arms from the handgonnes of 1500s to matchlocks, wheellocks, and flintlocks through the early 1800s.


Hall 1842 Flintlock-01.jpg
Hall 1842 Flintlock-02.jpg
Hall 1842 Flintlock-03.jpg
Hall 1842 Flintlock-04.jpg
Hall Percussion Action.jpg
Hall Flint Action.jpg

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PostPosted: 27 Nov 2016, 02:50 
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Joined: 05 Feb 2016, 03:42
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Location: Langley, BC
I accidentally shot a sheep with a Bren gun when I was at school in the UK. Jammed on the range and as I was clearing it on the bipod it fired about 2 miles down range. The farmer wasn't very happy.....


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PostPosted: 27 Nov 2016, 09:17 

Joined: 21 Jul 2011, 10:31
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Location: palmerton pa.
Amazing what was around years ago and that the "new stuff" is just modern adaptations of it!
Interesting piece.


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PostPosted: 27 Nov 2016, 09:52 
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stinkfoot wrote:
I accidentally shot a sheep with a Bren gun when I was at school in the UK. Jammed on the range and as I was clearing it on the bipod it fired about 2 miles down range. The farmer wasn't very happy.....

:LOL2:
I probably should not be laughing at this, but I did.



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PostPosted: 09 Dec 2016, 19:55 
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Joined: 14 Aug 2016, 22:25
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Location: Clayton California
Well I'm not afraid to show my ignorance. From the photo it looks like it still has a ramrod? If yes, I was just wondering why?



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PostPosted: 09 Dec 2016, 20:40 
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Joined: 05 May 2016, 18:46
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Location: Central Illinois
Are you using BP or pyrodex?

Nice find for you, I can never find anything that cool.



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PostPosted: 09 Dec 2016, 20:44 
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Joined: 05 May 2016, 18:46
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Location: Central Illinois
LDUBS wrote:
Well I'm not afraid to show my ignorance. From the photo it looks like it still has a ramrod? If yes, I was just wondering why?


A lot of firearms that were breech loaded still had "ramrods". The practice continued for many years and even on bolt action rifles of WWII and after. They were used mostly for cleaning and clearing obstructions from the barrel. Placing it on the rifle made sense because it didn't have to be carried separately and was harder for the soldier to lose.



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PostPosted: 09 Dec 2016, 21:25 
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Joined: 12 Dec 2014, 14:32
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Location: Eastern Mass
This rifle actually has a ramrod to use to load the rifle if/when the breechblock gets too fouled up from heavy & continuous firing and won't open up properly.

In fact, at the muzzle the last 1-1/2" of the barrel isn't rifled at all, but counter-bored , so you can thumb start a ball and push it down into the barrel, then use the ramrod to seat it down on top of the powder. Pouring the powder down first just like a regular muzzleloader of course!



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PostPosted: 11 Dec 2016, 22:40 
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Joined: 14 Aug 2016, 22:25
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Location: Clayton California
Guys, thanks for responding to my question about the ramrod. Makes sense. I was just reading some historical fiction about the Peninsular War (early 1800's) where 4 rounds per minute of flintlock musket fire was considered fast. That is probably why this caught my attention.

Take care.



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PostPosted: 27 Dec 2016, 20:08 
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Location: Eastern Mass
I shot it today, what a hoot! First shot was tied down to the bench w/ rope and trigger pulled by a long string, but all was well. As is when I shot it I used only 50-grn FFg loads under a 0.525" cast and lubed roundball, no patch needed.

If any of you have ever shot a BP revolver, you know how much flash/smoke there is at the forcing cone, even on a modern revolver ... well with the tilting breech block, the effect was the same. I can't imagine shooting one of these, in flintlock ignition, with the standard service load of 82 or 100-grains of powdah.

On a good note, 3-shots printed a quarter-sized group offhand at 25-yards, but yielded a 4"'group offhand at 50-yards. Being almost 180-years old the bore looks like a crusty sewer pipe, even though I cleaned/scrubbed the heck out of it w/ J&B Bore Paste. Maybe some of the pits caused the lead ball to strip, so I may try under-sized balls (0.520") in paper cartridges, where the ball wrapped in paper is thn dunked into liquid lube of 50/50 beeswax and olive oil.



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#2) 25' Parker refurb from EMPTY hull http://www.classicparker.com/phpBB3/vie ... p?f=15&t=6
#3) 16' V-tin rebuild viewtopic.php?f=21&t=36465
#4 Procraft SV14
#5) 16' Starcraft entirely NEW Transom Skins viewtopic.php?f=3&t=37548
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PostPosted: 28 Dec 2016, 12:35 

Joined: 19 Jan 2012, 07:44
Posts: 2926
Location: Northeast Arkansas
Dale, you call this an inline, but it's not really an inline is it? I thought by definition, an "inline" meant that the ignition spark, whether from a percussion cap, a 409 primer or whatever, was inline with the barrel and not at a 90° or some portion of that angle to the barrel.



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